Author Topic: P323 Standing rigging tuning  (Read 1854 times)

selene

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P323 Standing rigging tuning
« on: July 24, 2019, 10:27:45 PM »
In the next few weeks I am going to pull and replace all the chainplates - Garhauer will make new ones for a decent price. Hey, it's been 40 years! :-) In preparation I checked the tension on the standing rigging - seems a bit loose to me (in fact, leeward shrouds are loose - very loose (floppy) - when heeling).

Do you guys have recommendations for shroud/stay tension?

Selene is currently:
Backstay                 600lbs  (insulated)
Aft lower shroud      700lb
Upper (cap) shroud  530lb
Fwd lower               700lb
Forestay                 ?? (roller furler)

All of these are around 5% of breaking strength for the wire...well below the 10-15% often recommended.

Thoughts?

selene

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Re: P323 Standing rigging tuning
« Reply #1 on: August 15, 2019, 09:39:38 AM »
UPDATE:

Well, not a lot of feedback on my post :-). Based on research - and almost nothing from Pearson! - typical guidelines are to tension to 10%-15% breaking strength of the wire (racing boats up to 20%). Without going into a lot of detail, I took care the mast was straight, and introduced a small rake (yes, our big thick masts do bend!), and tightened the rig...

(as an aside: Our lower shrouds are 1x19 316 s/s.  1/4" BS for 316 is 7,600lb; cap shrouds and stays are 9/32", with a BS of 7,800lb)

New tensions:
  Aft lower: ~580lbs
  Cap shrouds/upper: 750lb
  Fwd lower: 800lb
  Backstay: 980lb

With the rig tuned like this, I was able to point ~5% higher. And my leeward shrouds no longer flop around in moderate (15-20kn) winds!

Ideally I would have put a little more on the fore/back stays - there is still some headstay sag - but noticed that as I added a couple more turns on the turnbuckle, the tension did not increase. However, after measuring the fwd-aft length of the boat, the hull was beginning to bend. So I guess the was not designed for a really tight rig, and I think around 900lb may be optimal.

Well, that's all for a bit. I just pulled the chainplates (which were actually in good shape! Oh, well) so more experimentation will have to wait for a while. But this has convinced me that (within moderate limits) tuning the 323 rig can improve performance. Yes, possibly "duh", but...

Rusty Pelican

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Re: P323 Standing rigging tuning
« Reply #2 on: August 16, 2019, 09:14:57 AM »
A P232 owner at my club cranked down his backstay such, he could not open his starboard cockpit locker. Kind scared me. Ater we let off the pressure, all was fine.
The stern must have deformed a bit.
I use the Loos tool to tune the mast, works fine. I think I am around 10% or so.
The P323, after 37 continuous seasons cruising the NE coast has taught, me many things.
#1 give her what she wants.
Yes the P323 can be bent and it is good, not designed for a rake.


Valor

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Re: P323 Standing rigging tuning
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2019, 01:13:46 PM »
A few days ago I put a few turns into my back stay to tighten up my fore stay and what a huge difference it made in my ability to point. Normally, 60 degree's off the wind is close hauled for my boat which is absurd considering every time you tack, you're almost making a u turn. Yesterday I was close hauled at 41 degree's in 8 knots and tacking is well below 100 degree's now.  I didn't put a gauge on it to see where I'm at but It really can't be a hell of a lot because it didn't require any real effort the put a few turns in.
Michael M

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SeaFever

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Re: P323 Standing rigging tuning
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2019, 09:04:25 AM »
I replaced my mast step and I still need to fine-tune the rig. I acquired a tension gauge and plan to try out some of these settings when I get back to the boat. (it sucks having a long distance relationship with a boat!)

Having raced boats in a couple of different one-design fleets (J22 and U20) the topic of "base settings" for rig tension is very important in my book - confirmed here with improved pointing ability. I always cherished the existence of the rigging guides which were developed with time on the water.  I have a rough draft of a rigging guide I started a while back and I hope to be able to test on the P323 and weigh-in on this topic.

Thanks for the tension numbers and Fair Sails!
« Last Edit: November 07, 2019, 09:54:18 AM by admin »
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Chance

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Re: P323 Standing rigging tuning
« Reply #5 on: September 30, 2019, 09:03:58 PM »
On CHANCE 1977 323 we start by putting  the mast in  the center of boat in mast collar  After that we start by running the main halyard with a 50 foot steel tape attach.  Then hoist to the top of mast and cleated.  Now take tape and measure  to the shroud pins attach to the turnbuckles.  This will center the mast then tighten to about 43 on a loos gauge 750 lb. keep checking with the tape to center the spar we end up at about 46 or 1100 lb . Tighten the lower front shrouds  first so the spar is straight ,going back and forth side to side keep it straight port to starboard set at 500lb. Next your aft shroud same as front shrouds at 500lb. Sheet your main boom in tight center on traveler . Now get off the boat and sight the mast  from the side 100 feet away, for forward and aft rake . Try to get the mast straight up and down by tightening the fore stay and back stay check pressure on your sheet does not affect the back stay easy out main sheet.tighten the back stay to about 43 or 750lb.  Now take a look at the mast check fore and aft try to get  straight as possible.  If you have roller furling or a foil the fore stay well only have to be set once not every year.  Now sail the boat ,take look up the spar that is straight no fall off the top mast and straight in mid section to top. my lowers are at about 1100 lb and upper also 1100lb.  I have and adjustable hydraulic back stay which is usually at 1000 lb  more if its above 20 mph .you will bend the boat so aft bins well not open if not careful .The sails cut for most boats other then high tech well have about 6" of fall off on the fore stay keeps the boat power up even J boats 3"or 4"  Pearson 323 is not a great pointing boat but reaches and down wind we do well  As i always say every boat has it day to win races!  Another thing I did was where the spreader is pin ,add  another 1/4" bolt to keep the spreaders from swing it works great the bolt is about  1 1/2 " from pin aft.   Bob K CHANCE OWNER 42 years!

Valor

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Re: P323 Standing rigging tuning
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2019, 09:10:21 AM »
@Chance, great info. There were a lot of numbers up there that seemed to change a few times but if I read your post right, I think in the end it looks like all of your shrouds are at 1100lbs and the back stay is at a minimum of 750 lbs with no sheet tension but can be above 1000lbs if it's above 20 knts.? Is that correct?
Michael M

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